Iraqi police claim American soldiers executed innocent people

[Yosemite Joy]

[William Calley isn't involved this time]

Kansas City Star

Iraqi police accuse American troopsU.S. says charges of 11 executions ‘highly unlikely’
By MATTHEW SCHOFIELD
The Star’s foreign correspondent

BAGHDAD — Iraqi police have accused American troops of executing 11 persons, including a 75-year-old woman and a 6-month-old infant, in the aftermath of a raid last Wednesday north of Baghdad.

The villagers were killed after American troops herded them into a single room of the house, according to a police document obtained by Knight Ridder Newspapers. The soldiers also burned three vehicles, killed the villagers’ animals and blew up the house, the document said.

A U.S. military spokesman, Maj. Tim Keefe, said that the U.S. military has no information to support the allegations and that he had not heard of them before a reporter brought them to his attention Sunday.

“We’re concerned to hear accusations like that, but it’s also highly unlikely that they’re true,â€� he said. He added that U.S. forces, “take every precaution to keep civilians out of harm’s way. The loss of innocent life, especially children, is regrettable.â€�

Accusations that U.S. troops have killed civilians are commonplace in Iraq, though most are judged later to be unfounded or exaggerated. But the report of the killings in the Abu Sifa area of Ishaqi, eight miles north of the city of Balad, is unusual because it originated with Iraqi police and because Iraqi police were willing to attach their names to it.

The report was compiled by the Joint Coordination Center in Tikrit, a regional security center set up with United States military assistance. An Iraqi police colonel signed the report, which was based on communications from local police.

Brig. Gen. Issa al Juboori, who leads the center, said that his office assembled the report on Thursday and that it accurately reflects the direction of the current police investigation into the incident.

The case involves a U.S. raid conducted, according to the official U.S. account, in response to a tip that a member of al-Qaida in Iraq was at the house.

Neighbors, interviewed by a special correspondent for Knight Ridder, agreed that the al-Qaida member was at the house.

According to police, military and eyewitness accounts, U.S. forces approached the house at around 2:30 a.m. and a firefight ensued. By all accounts, in addition to exchanging gunfire with someone inside the house, U.S. troops were supported by helicopter gunships, which fired on the house.

But the accounts differ on what took place after the firefight.

According to the U.S. account, the house collapsed because of the heavy fire. When U.S. forces searched the rubble they found one man, the al-Qaida suspect, alive. He was arrested. They also found a dead man they believed to be connected to al-Qaida, two dead women and a dead child.

But the report filed by the Joint Coordination Center, which was based on a report filed by local police, said U.S. forces entered the house while it was still standing.

“The American forces gathered the family members in one room and executed 11 persons, including five children, four women and two men,â€� the report said. “Then they bombed the house, burned three vehicles and killed their animals.â€�

The report was signed by Col. Fadhil Muhammed Khalaf, who was described in the document as the assistant chief of the Joint Coordination Center.

A local police commander, Lt. Col. Farooq Hussain, interviewed by a Knight Ridder special correspondent in Ishaqi, said autopsies at the hospital in Tikrit “revealed that all the victims had bullet shots in the head and all bodies were handcuffed.â€�

Efforts to reach hospital spokesmen Sunday were unsuccessful. Keefe, the U.S. military spokesman, said that he had seen photographs of the victims and had not seen handcuffs, which caused him to doubt the validity of the report.

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/world/14139628.htm

[Patagoniamaniac]

I heard that ..super sad..that stuff sucks..but I truly wish the news would report the positives of the war and how many of soldiers have great hearts and truly bond with the iraqi people...

[Patagoniamaniac]

America Supports You: Iraqi Children Receive Donations
By 1st Lt. Kevin Norton, USA
Special to American Forces Press Service

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Jul2005/20050706_1988.html

BAGHDAD, Iraq, July 6, 2005 – Task Force Baghdad soldiers said they have been overwhelmed and overjoyed by donations Americans have been sending to a program designed to provide school supplies, clothes and toys to Iraqi children.

Iraqi students pose with U.S. soldiers from 3rd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, for a photo with the school supplies donated through the Iraqi Schools Program. Army photo (Click photo for screen-resolution image);high-resolution image available.

The "Iraqi Schools Program," founded by Army Maj. Greg Softy in August 2003, is currently being managed by soldiers of 3rd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division. Softy was the squadron operations officer with 1st Squadron, 1st Cavalry Regiment, 1st Armored Division, and has since rotated back to Germany.

Iraqi Schools is a widely successful program that links Americans with an actual neighborhood of Iraqis who need help. The generosity of Americans has allowed the 3rd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment -- known as the "Cottonbalers" -- to distribute vital school supplies, medical supplies and clothing to Iraqis in need.

As of May 25, 42,682 packages had been received with 1,013,274 pounds of school supplies, clothing, and toys distributed in the West Rashid area of Baghdad.

The early success of the program even caught the attention of President Bush, who acknowledged the program in a weekly radio address in October 2003: "The response was overwhelming - hundreds of packages were shipped, and a Web site was established to encourage other Americans to contribute," Bush said. The program continues to grow under the operation of Army Maj. Dave Priatko and the men of 3/7 Infantry. The Cottonbalers say they are extremely excited about working with the program. "It's absolutely amazing how much we've been able to distribute," said 1st Lt. Steve Weber of 3/7's B Company. "We've been able to give out school supplies to smiling children on every patrol we conduct."

Priatko, the battalion executive officer, serves as the director of the program and its main point of contact. Priatko; Chaplain (Capt.) Suk Kim, the battalion chaplain; and his assistant, Sgt. Robert Harris, do most of the heavy lifting in terms of running the program. They receive and sort mail, collate the different types of supplies, and repackage them for the line companies to distribute in sector.

Priatko and the chaplain then update the Web site dedicated to publicizing the program. Every month, they send a progress report and post pictures for the people back home to enjoy. The line companies do the rest.

The program has a positive effect on the soldiers who participate.

"My favorite missions are those that are geared specifically to handing stuff out to kids and visiting the schools," said Army Staff Sgt. Ortiz Arroyo, of the battalion's primary security detachment. "There isn't a man out here who doesn't thoroughly enjoy the smiles of the school kids."

Priatko also said he sees the huge boost in morale that comes from taking part in the Iraqi Schools Program. "The experience is equally gratifying for our soldiers when they see the smiles on the faces of each of these children," he said. Unit officials said the Iraqi Schools Program is valuable in terms of building relations with the Iraqi people. This benefit is not lost on the men of 3/7 Infantry.

"The efforts of our friends and families at home are deeply humbling. It's things like this that make it an honor to represent the American people," said 1st Lt. Ryan Tate, a member of the battalion's intelligence section.

(Army 1st Lt. Kevin Norton is assigned to the 3rd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment.)

[Yosemite Joy]

I watched Nightline a couple nights ago as they were examining the basis of why Bush (and you I guess ba, ba) want the media (the evil empire ha!) to show the positive of the war on the Iraqis.

So they sent out one of their reporters to seek out a positive story. He found one, a comedy show being filmed in Iraq for television there. Everyone seemed jovial and having a good time. Until the phone rang and the man who set up the interview and report for Nightline was shot dead on his way to work. The very man who runs the "entertainment" section of this particular television network. Shot dead on the streets as he went to work.

Needlesstosay the report ended sadly and with a coffin.

[Yosemite Joy]

And pata, all due respect for seeking out a happy report, but it is a year old. It is great that kids are getting donations etc over in Iraq.

I hate to be negative, but this war is civil (depending who you talk to) already, and some of these children are probably dead.

[Yosemite Joy]

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2631&ncid=263...323/wl_csm/ofuture_1 (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2631&ncid=2631&e=48&u=/csm/20060323/wl_csm/ofuture_1)

Happy news. From today. Sorry, no children or puppies saved, but good news.

[Patagoniamaniac]

Originally posted by Yosemite Joy:
And pata, all due respect for seeking out a happy report, but it is a year old. It is great that kids are getting donations etc over in Iraq.

I hate to be negative, but this war is civil (depending who you talk to) already, and some of these children are probably dead.

This was the first thing I cam across. Tried looking for pictures of soldiers with kids . I've received some awesome shots before. I realize this was an older article..just the first thing I came across...no time to search for recent articles today..

[Patagoniamaniac]

Originally posted by Yosemite Joy:
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2631&ncid=263...323/wl_csm/ofuture_1 (http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2631&ncid=2631&e=48&u=/csm/20060323/wl_csm/ofuture_1)

Happy news. From today. Sorry, no children or puppies saved, but good news.

Great article...thanks!

[beautiful_mess38]

I get good news from the Bigman everyday. He works with Iraqi civilians. You have know idea how appreciative they are. Especially when the only reason why there camp gets mortored is to kill the Iraqi citizens working there.

They Bigman tells me great story's.

[Coldwolf]

is to kill the Iraqi citizens working there.


Thats part of that civil war that is going on.

[Patagoniamaniac]

Originally posted by beautiful_mess38:
I get good news from the Bigman everyday. He works with Iraqi civilians. You have know idea how appreciative they are. Especially when the only reason why there camp gets mortored is to kill the Iraqi citizens working there.

They Bigman tells me great story's.

THats awesome to hear Messy...coming right from someone who is experiencing it first hand..

[Yosemite Joy]

Umm, I do believe the reporters are experiencing it first hand.

[monkey]

Ummm, I do believe reporters have an objective, to get published, on the air, etc. Bad news pays.
I'm not saying awful things aren't going on, but there are good stories also, we just don't get to hear them often. Wether it is overseas or locally, bad news usually gets all the publicity.
Personally, I'm glad my life isn't focused on the evil and bad things in this world. I can aknowledge them, do what I find I am able to do to make things better and move on with my life. I'm glad I am able to appreciate the goodness in some of the simple things in life. I don't need to harp on issue that I have no real control over.

[Yosemite Joy]

Well actually you do have control over it. At least on this shore. Personally, I am glad I take the time to read about and learn about the affairs of the world, rather than just focus on my immediate surroundings. I would much rather be informed on something that my country is involved in, than to see no evil, hear no evil, and speak no evil.

Personally I think that people who choose to ignore the world and current affairs are far worse than those who take a stand.

So since you obviously know something about Darfur, you have done what you can right? You have donated? Since you know that something (say for instance, this particular lil' war) is unjust and based on BS you have voted differently, you have written your congressman, you have done something about it? Oh, wait, there is nothing that we the People can't do. I mean Impeachment is only for Presidents who get a lil' lil' on the side right?

And finally, personally I find it a great way to keep up on life, here and abroad, to read the newspaper everyday, and to doubt most of what I read. To read books on history, politics, geography, and culture. If I feel deeply about something, negative or positive, it certainly isn't because I am a horrible meany who hates the world. It is because I am educated enough on the subject to hold an opinion and defend it.

One last thing, I am a mother, who's life revolves around her household, her children, and her husband. If I have some spare time to myself to enjoy what I love and feel passionate about (ie politics, reporting, and literature) there is no evil in that. While I wait for the time to pass until I get to finish school, I can at least have some sort of adult conversation and debate about something that is fascinating.

[beautiful_mess38]

Originally posted by Yosemite Joy:
Umm, I do believe the reporters are experiencing it first hand.

I disagree the reporters are not experiencing it first hand. The soldiers are. And when my husbands camp gets mortered or bombed he is too. When Iraqi civilians come in and tell him stories about what happend in thier little village there are no reporters there.

[John @ 3300ft.]

Before they were executed, the soldiers made them eat pork and convert to Christianity...

[MadScot]

When Iraqi civilians come in and tell him stories about what happend in thier little village there are no reporters there.

This is not first hand this is second hand or as they put it in court hearsay.

Did you read Coldwolfs other post.
"According to military officials, the inquiry acknowledged that, contrary to the military's initial report, the 15 civilians killed on Nov. 19 died at the hands of the Marines, not the insurgents."

Now look at the military comments on this new story.

“We’re concerned to hear accusations like that, but it’s also highly unlikely that they’re true,â€� he said. He added that U.S. forces, “take every precaution to keep civilians out of harm’s way. The loss of innocent life, especially children, is regrettable.â€�

This is by no means a denial.
We heard that torture wasn't widespread that also turned out to be untrue.
We now find out about the "black room" near the airport that was kept in operation after Abu Graib they only had one rule in the black room no blood anything else goes. How many times do you have to be lied to before you begin to question whether you can trust anything they say. Let me make it clear I'm not talking about the boots here. I'm talking about the Commanders and the Spooks.

Messy I believe that the Iraqis your husband works with are grateful but they don't represent the population as a whole they are ones with jobs and I venture to say I doubt many if any of them are Sunnis. You can't have a successful underground campaign without having a lot of support from the local population where you are hiding. The number of people killed every day climbs exponentially. Regardless of how much good we do we will forever be invaders in the minds of a huge portion of Iraqis.

Afghanistan is viewed as the straw that broke the back of the Soviet Union. They were in very much the same position we are in now in Iraq. Spending good money after bad winning every battle and losing the war. It's the same story throughout history. It's not hard to take over another country but maintaining control is another story.

[Patagoniamaniac]

Originally posted by John @ 3300ft.:
Before they were executed, the soldiers made them eat pork and convert to Christianity...

WOW!.porkchops and apple sauce with mashed potatoes instead of mutton with curry..and a good dose of Jesus?...They are rejoicing in heaven maybe..

[beautiful_mess38]

Originally posted by MadScot:
[QUOTE]When Iraqi civilians come in and tell him stories about what happend in thier little village there are no reporters there.


read people read

I did not say Baghdad, I said thier "little" villages where the reporters do not go.
The Bigmans camp is 32 miles south of Baghdad. The reporters never go there.
The Bigman has never seen a reporter.

What I'm saying from this post is there are bad things that happen in these little villages where the insurgents go. Reporters are not there.
There are also good things that happen. But the reporters do not post that.

The reporters are not in the war first hand like YJ said.
The soldiers are. There is war all over Iraq not just in Baghdad.

[Yosemite Joy]

I'm sorry Messy, did you think that these murders took place in Baghdad? You aren't paying attention.

[Yosemite Joy]

Originally posted by Patagoniamaniac:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by John @ 3300ft.:
Before they were executed, the soldiers made them eat pork and convert to Christianity...

WOW!.porkchops and apple sauce with mashed potatoes instead of mutton with curry..and a good dose of Jesus?...They are rejoicing in heaven maybe.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seriously, this is the funniest (but terrible sad funny, still funny) thing I have read in so long. (does that make me a bad person?)

[Patagoniamaniac]

It's sad that the media reports what people want to hear..And that is.. the negative aspect of this war...Just because we have not seen immediate positve results from this war... (Americans want to see things done immediatly)..it takes time... and yes..sadly it costs lives. I heard a soldier on CNN...mention that they are there to support the president and to eventually establish a liberated country...FREEDOM..just as we so greatfully have here in America...they knew when they joined the forces, the risks they would be taking to support our country at the time they enlisted...Just as any American . I pray this war would end soon and we could bring our boys and girls home soon... and... that Iraq can independently begin to build a country free of a vicious dictator and that iraqi's can have the freedom to build a life just as we have here in America..

[Patagoniamaniac]

Originally posted by Yosemite Joy:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Patagoniamaniac:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by John @ 3300ft.:
Before they were executed, the soldiers made them eat pork and convert to Christianity...

WOW!.porkchops and apple sauce with mashed potatoes instead of mutton with curry..and a good dose of Jesus?...They are rejoicing in heaven maybe.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seriously, this is the funniest (but terrible sad funny, still funny) thing I have read in so long. (does that make me a bad person?) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



Y.J. If thinking that makes you a bad person..what does that make me?... http://oakhurstonline.com/icon/shocked.gif..that was pretty funny though huh?? http://oakhurstonline.com/icon/laugh.gif

[beautiful_mess38]

Originally posted by Yosemite Joy:
I'm sorry Messy, did you think that these murders took place in Baghdad? You aren't paying attention.

I'm not talking just about these murders YJ. I'm talking in general. My husband is there. I pay attention. He tell me things the reporters will never tell you.

[jakobscalpel]

Originally posted by Patagoniamaniac:
Just because we have not seen immediate positve results from this war... (Americans want to see things done immediatly)..it takes time... and yes..sadly it costs lives. I heard a soldier on CNN...mention that they are there to support the president and to eventually establish a liberated country...FREEDOM..

There are a couple of problems with this.

1. RE: Wanting "immediate" results. We've been at war for three years in Iraq. That is one year less than we fought in world war II. Granted, we used many more soldiers in world war II, but the country was willing to use a draft back then and accept it. Do you think a draft would be accepted today? If not, then it is hard to claim that "Americans want to see things done immediately".

2. RE: establishing a liberated country. They have done that. They have held nationwide elections (three times, by my count). Bush said. "In great numbers and under great risk, Iraqis have shown their commitment to democracy." Yeah! The problem with freedom is that everyone has it, and they may not do what we like them to do....such as precipitate a civil war, just like my southern US ancestors did.

One last comment. I have no doubt that many US folks in Iraq, whether military or not, are good people. I'm sure Messy would vouch for BigMan, and the good things that he is doing there. Look at any activity on the scale of the Iraq operation/war and you will find individuals doing both extreme good and bad and every graduation in-between. However, all the individual good acts in the world can't change the fact this has been a strategic level disaster (as well as being immoral). Any individual good acts are simply chiseling away at one almighty big stone of bad.